An American Style Carriage

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Geeky Gecko
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An American Style Carriage

Postby Geeky Gecko » Sat Oct 29, 2011 9:05 pm

I've started on a carriage for my loco to push about. It will be to a nominal 1:25 scale and will be constructed mainly out of card. The chassis and bogies will be constructed from styrene.
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The floor scribed with planking and the chassis rails laminated before assembly on a mirror to ensure flatness. The floor stained and the rails painted before coating in dilute pva.
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Assembly started and more rails added. The area in the centre is the location for the rolling chassis when constructed.
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The interior layer of the sides before cutting and staining.
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Laminated to the middle layer. Note the size difference between layers of the window openings, forming a groove to locate the window frames.
The third, outer, layer was well under way when I realised I had measured the card incorrectly. Incidentally, on the subject of measuring, I discovered a plastic rule I had bought for use when drawing has markings that are undersize when compared to a steel rule I use for marking out: 0.5mm over 300mm.
Last edited by Geeky Gecko on Sun Jul 30, 2017 4:41 am, edited 6 times in total.
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Postby PeterH » Sun Oct 30, 2011 4:17 am

Nice work. Did you glue the boards with dilute PVA ? I would have thought dots of undilute would be the way to go.
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Postby Geeky Gecko » Sun Oct 30, 2011 7:12 am

Peter,
I usually use neat pva for construction and dilute (50/50) pva for sealing and finishing. When laminating layers together, I often seal both pieces with dilute pva and after they have dried, join them using neat pva. I sometimes think I construct models using card-reinforced-pva rather than card. This stops the card absorbing the pva immediately and curling, and allows time to slide the pieces for alignment.
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Postby PeterH » Mon Oct 31, 2011 6:53 am

Aaaah ... Ta
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Postby Geeky Gecko » Sun Nov 06, 2011 10:22 am

Image

Here's a shot of the sides showing internal and external sides, placed for photographic purposes.

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This shows the layers to make one of the top rails which will interlock with the sides for strength after the windows have been slid into place.

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This shows the ends before assembly and final trimming to size. Another layer for the internal face is required.


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Here's the doors during cutting of the three layers that will make up each of them. The middle panels will be windows.
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Postby Geeky Gecko » Sat Nov 12, 2011 8:01 pm

Here's a shot of one of the sides with the top rail temporarily assembled:

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The carriage ends are causing me few problems, so I've put them to one side for the moment.

Here's the doors showing construction from 3 laminations, before being separated. One for each end.

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The windows differ in construction in that the 'glass' is structural. I attach strips of self adhesive address labels around the perimeter then glue strips of card for the frame to these. The verticals protrude on one face of each. These fit in the groove left in the sides either side of the window openings.

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Here's a couple in situ:

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Postby Geeky Gecko » Sun Nov 20, 2011 8:47 pm

Had another go at making the ends. They are made from four layers to provide something for the doors to close against. Actually, they should have been identical not mirror images of themselves. Here they are each assembled to a side.

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I've realised that I've painted the top of the frames of the lower windows red, which will need to be rectified somehow.
Here is evidence of another error. The inner laminations should have been shaped to fit around the base.

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Thinking ahead, has anyone modelled interior gas or oil lamps? I'm toying with attempting some wall mounted lamps. I can't justify the expense of the items available for dolls houses.
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Postby Mark Goodwin » Sun Nov 20, 2011 11:06 pm

Stefan,

I don't know whether the lamp castings from Mike Rayner of Smallbrook Studios GN15 Emett Festival Coach could assist. If suitable, Mike is often willing to sell the individual castings as required.

http://www.smallbrookstudio.com/page5.php

This is the link, scroll down to the festival coach.

Kind regards,
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Postby Geeky Gecko » Tue Nov 22, 2011 9:36 pm

Thanks for the link, Mark. That isn't quite what I had in mind though. I'm thinking of a style that has a glass globe like these:
http://www.antiques-atlas.com/antique/pair_victorian_wall_oil_lamps/as105a350
I want them wall mounted so that I can remove the roof withou risking damage.
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Postby Artizen » Tue Nov 22, 2011 10:47 pm

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Postby Gerry Bullock » Wed Nov 23, 2011 8:48 am

Stefan before you purchase items from the links Ian posted be sure to get supplier to provide you with detailed dimensions.
Many 1/24 scale miniatures sold by the Doll's House fraternity are far from being 1/24, in many cases they're closer to 1/12 in spite of what they say.
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Postby Artizen » Wed Nov 23, 2011 10:51 pm

Agreed. But bear in mind that these examples have working lights which compromise scale simply because they are using incandescent bulbs instead of LEDs. The use of LEDs in dolls house lighting is only now slowly being introduced. The other limiter is of course that dolls house has always traditionally been 1:12 and the 1:24 range is limited in comparison. There is a new push into 1:16 and 1:48 but those ranges are even more limited.

If in doubt, buy a non-working light of the correct dimension and style and attempt to adapt it to LED operation using surface mount LEDs around 0402 in size (if you are brave!).
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Postby Geeky Gecko » Sun Nov 27, 2011 8:02 pm

Thanks everybody for the feedback. My wife has suggested I try a stall on the local market that sells a large selection of beads.
Only modeeling to report on is a stove to keep passengers warm and some seating (more needed).
[img][img]http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x251/geekygeckodad/US%20Carriage/PB270674.jpg[/img][/img]
I've made provision to fit lighting to the stove. It also needs a pin to simulate the pivot on the catch.
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Postby Geeky Gecko » Sun Dec 04, 2011 9:06 am

Jumping about a bit I've been thinking about wheels and bogies. I've sourced some wheels which need insulating bushes and axles.
The wheels are Triang/Hornby Rocket.

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To fit the bushes, I inserted a pin into a board:

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Select a length of tube that is a press fit into the wheel, in this case it is the tube off a can of WD40,and file a small chamfer on the end. Cut the required length and place the tube chamfer end up over the pin.

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Place the wheel over the bush, wobble it from side to side to help locate it centrally, then keeping the wheel flat, gently press the wheel down onto the bush.

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In this case the internal hole is correct for a press fit for a 1mm axle after opening out the end of the hole slightly with a notice board pin.
The cranks will be hidden behind the bogie side frames.
Seven of the bushes went in easily. The last one jammed and buckled on the first attempt:

Image
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Postby Geeky Gecko » Fri Dec 23, 2011 4:09 pm

I've been knocking up some bogies. Rather than just having a bogie that wobbles about it's central pivot, I wanted independent equalisation for it's axles and an ability to rock fore and aft.
The first is constructed using rectangular styrene tube:
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The second is made from layers of styrene:
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The second is probably easier to make accurately and has the advantage that the axles can simply be dropped into position.
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Postby MrPlantpot » Fri Dec 23, 2011 6:14 pm

Hi Stefan,
They both look great. Are you going to add springs? I've a feeling that if you mount them to the chassis as they are, the coach will flop over to one side or the other. Unless of course, I've misinterpreted your pictures, and you only have the 'compensation' on one axle per bogie.
Also, I'm puzzled about the crank pin holes in the Rocket wheels... will you be using them, filling them, grinding them, or just hiding them inside the bogie frames?
My Mum calls me Steve.
1:32 on 16·5mm track. Gnot strictly minimum gauge... but it is the minimum that I'm working with !
And now... a critter in 1/24th... from scratch!

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Postby Geeky Gecko » Fri Dec 23, 2011 8:24 pm

Hello Steve,
No, I don't intend to add springing, but one axle will be rigidly mounted, to keep the body level, by using two staples, placed near the outside edges of the bogie chassis instead of one in the centre. The cranks should be hidden behind the axle bearing boxes, at least to the casual observer.
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Postby PeterH » Sat Dec 24, 2011 2:54 am

That looks nice and simple, but I can't figure out the principle. Can you explain how the equalisation happens, or a quick sketch ?
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Postby Geeky Gecko » Sat Dec 24, 2011 11:12 am

I was awake early this morning so construction on the bogies got under way.
I suppose I should say that I can't claim the originality of the design.
Here's a few pictures of the construction which may explain the way axles are equalised:
Image
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This shows the staples fitted into the top layer. The staples transfer the weight to the axles.
The pair of staples will keep the carriage level. The single staple will allow the axle to rock.
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This layer is approximately the same thickness as the staples and does little but put the next layer in the right place.
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This is the third layer and the most critical as it locates the axles horizontally.
The gaps must provide a sliding fit for axles allowing them to rock without allowing them to slop about.
This layer is thicker than the axle diameter.
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This shows the construction of mechanism that prevents the wheelsets dropping out.
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The wheels in place.
Image

Just the tilting/swivelling mechanism to construct now.
Last edited by Geeky Gecko on Sat Sep 05, 2015 2:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Adrian » Sun Dec 25, 2011 2:44 am

G'day Stefan

Not seen bogies made like that before ..... but I really like it !

Simple and anybody (including me) could probably copy and get them to work !

As an added bonus, if you used wheel-sets with muffs you could pick up power from the two staples on the 'fixed' axle for your coach lighting.

Thanks for posting, you have given me an unexpected christmas present.

Cheers
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Postby PeterH » Sun Dec 25, 2011 3:41 am

Great. Thanks for posting the photos.
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Postby Geeky Gecko » Sun Dec 25, 2011 5:11 pm

Hope that explains the principle, Peter.
Adrian, I like your idea of split axles to pick up power from the track through the staples. In this case I'm planning to use on-board battery power. I can't take the credit for the design. I know I've seen staples used for pivots somewhere before.
I was up early again this morning ( I was woken up by some idiot in a red suit with half a dozen reindeer in the garden ) and I've made a start on the tilt mechanism:
Image

Merry Christmas everybody,
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Postby Geeky Gecko » Tue Dec 27, 2011 8:51 am

Completed the rest of the components for tilting and swivelling mechanism of the bogies:
[img][img]http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x251/geekygeckodad/US%20Carriage/PC270767-1.jpg[/img]
[/img]Image
[img][img]http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x251/geekygeckodad/US%20Carriage/PC270769-1.jpg[/img][/img]
[img][img]http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x251/geekygeckodad/US%20Carriage/PC270771-1.jpg[/img][/img]
However, all was not well. With the weight of the carriage body on the bogie, the 'rigid' axle tilted. I had forgotten that there was nothing to locate the axle vertically in the correct position. Even with a strip of styrene trapped beneath the axle and some staples pushed into the gap outboard of the pair of staples, the tolerances add up and allow the body to rock alarmingly. I may have to try and fix some bushes rigidly in place as bearings for this axle. With the loose pin replaced with some screws as the tilting pivot to reduce the play here, and a bit of ballast in the bogie frame the situation improves, but the bogies themselves need more weight. Unfortunately adding weight externally may ruin the unobtrusiveness of the bogie that would keep it unnoticed behind the planned external frames.
[img][img]http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x251/geekygeckodad/US%20Carriage/PC270772-1.jpg[/img][/img]
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Postby MrPlantpot » Tue Dec 27, 2011 10:10 am

Hi Stefan,
I had a feeling on Friday that something like this might happen. My first thought was to make the gap under the rigid axle deeper, and put a transverse leaf spring under the axle (centre down, ends up), but if you've already tried packing the gap, that idea may not work.... so after another few minutes thought.... is it possible to use longer axles with bearings in the bogie frames, just on the two fixed axles? I'd hate to see your idea binned, it's a good one. Good Luck.
My Mum calls me Steve.

1:32 on 16·5mm track. Gnot strictly minimum gauge... but it is the minimum that I'm working with !

And now... a critter in 1/24th... from scratch!

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Postby Mozzer » Tue Dec 27, 2011 10:49 am

there no need to make the wheels in the bogies compansated

if you make one bogie rock left/right of the coach & the other front/back of the coach
this way the bogie are compansated to the coach I have done it this way in OO O SM32 & G scale with no problems
suffering from M.E/CFS since 2007


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